That is absolutely ridiculous.

"What gay marriage is designed to do is not so much lift up homosexual unions (only a very small percentage of homosexuals wish to get married) but to cast down heterosexual unions."

Where do you get that, only a very small percentage of homosexuals wish to get married? And even if it were true, that doesn't take into consideration the fact that it is already illegal in most places, so there would be no desire. And how does saying two men or two women can get married denigrate the marriage of a man and a woman? That is what conservatives fail to explain. Did giving women the right to vote cast down the right of men to vote? Did giving blacks citizenship cast down the white man's status as citizen?

If that is the logical step you want to take, fine, but you have to extend it in all places. If extending rights and privledges to other human beings casts down the traditional mold of said right, it has to be so in all areas, be they voting, citizenship, or marriage. And society is based on much more than family (see 'It takes a village.')

I'm not a fan of Democrats, but was proud to see Feingold tell off Specter. This does nothing more than write discrimination into the Constitution and detract from real issues.

Nova,

Study after study confirms that most gay people - and especially most gay men - do not want to get married; and even in those that do get married, they still continue to have a large number of sex partners outside of primary relationship. Marriage isn't just a thing: it is the primary way we form our civilization and carry it on to the next generation - the privileges assigned to it aren't there just for fun but are a recognition of the crucial role family formation plays in our Judeo-Christian civilization - what gay marriage amounts to is a desire to have the benefits of marriage without the burdens.

What the proponents of gay marriage are trying to do is essentially cheapen the whole concept of marriage - make it completely into a social arrangement for financial convenience.

Sorry, but I'm not going to agree to the suicide of my civilization...

What gay marriage is designed to do is not so much lift up homosexual unions (only a very small percentage of homosexuals wish to get married) but to cast down heterosexual unions. The underlying concept is that the traditional family is an obstacle to the forward profress of society, so do whatever you can to make the family disintegrate

Mark, you have posted some pretty stupid things before, but this takes the cake. Name one advocate for gay marriage or civil unions who either wants to "cast down heterosexual unions" or thinks "the traditional family is an obstacle to the forward profress of society".

Since you can't do that, I expect a description of the unstated, ulterior motives of us "lefists." Perhaps you should start listening to what people say instead of what you fear about them.

Mark,

Keep up the fight and your efforts!

I'm not a fan of Senator Specter, but I was happy to see him tell Senator Feingold where to get off. I didn't know he had it in him!

It's long past time that we amend the Constitution to put a stop to gay marriage and many other liberal agenda items the left wants to force on the majority of American or eliminate from American culture. It's time Americans wake up and take America back from the left before liberals destroy the nation!

Liberals want Americans to believe that it is some big deal to amend the Constitution. That's one of their standard "lines" they "feed" the people anytime someone suggests amending the Constitution. People need to learn to ignore that liberal line and support whatever amendments it takes. And people need to understand too that activist liberal courts essentially amend the Constitution and make laws all the time. The liberal media just won't educate people to that fact. It's time the average American starts amending the Constitution and standing up for their own beliefs, values, an lifestyles before it's too late!

I don't know what it takes to get the Complacent Majority energized enough to fight for their beliefs, but we need some vocal leaders and groups to take the lead, coordinate the effort, and motivate the average American. If all of the various groups who actively oppose gay marriage and other liberal agenda items would get together, talk, develop a strategy, and work together on those items they can and do agree on, the liberal agenda can be stopped!

We can start with a constitutional amendment to prohibit gay marriage, and at the same time, take care of an amendment to make English our national language. It will take a constitutional amendment to stop the liberal activist judges. Nothing else will stop them!

If anyone wants gay marriage, move to Canada!

AAR

This whole thing is a re-election ploy, noting more as they know this will die on the Senate floor, but will give the republicans an opportunity to appeal to their conservative base to say "See, we're trying to get rid of gay marriage."

Although gay marriage was narrowly passed here in Canada last year, it is with little doubt that the mass majority of gay couples would be happy to have a civil union that is legally recognized and entitles them to the same benefits that married couples get. Only a small minority want the full church sanction marriage recognition. Canadian parliament here also left the door open for churchs to decline to participate based on religious values.

but, in the US, this goes deeper. Its not just a matter of Church and religious beliefs, it also is a matter of hatred. Many people hate those that are different from them or have views that differ from theirs.

There are those that are pusing hard to deny gays any rights. No civil unions, and now deny them from being able to adopt children.

This is what happens when you allow religion and state to mix. Next, you will be having the same fringe fundamentalists wanting to exclude non-Christians from certain rights and privilges.

This is not a matter of liberalism. Times have changed and gays are no longer hiding who they are and people are finding out they they make up a larger percentage of the population that conservatives could ever have imagined years ago.

Society needs to learn to adapt and show tolerance to those that are different. for you to say that "It's long past time that we amend the Constitution to put a stop to gay marriage" shos your short sightedness as you believe that you have the right to force your particular views on other people. Yet, if other people try and force their views on you, then you are outraged. Thats called a hypocrite.

The same wingnuts are doing the same in the anti-abortion circles. People with a rigid view want to force their beliefs on other people. But it goes further as some of these wingnuts don't just want to outlaw abortions. they also want to outlaw let's say personal use devices because they view sex as dirty. They also want to ban birth control and profolactics. STD's be damned they say, if god had intended to your get a disease then its his will and its wrong for you to use a device to inferfere with his will.

Gays are no different that you or I, other than their personal choice in lifestyle. They are doctors, lawyers, airline pilots, bus drivers, engineers, architects etc. Most simply want to exist in peace and be tolerated and be allowed to enjoy the same benefits as everyone else.

It takes a far bigger man to tolerate those different from yourself than to persecute them.

AAR,

Things the left wants to force on America? Forcing tolerance, yeah that is a terrible thing. It's not as if the left is trying to pass an amedment saying marriage is only between a man and a man, or only a woman and a woman. You aren't forced to be gay if gay marriage is allowed.

And in all seriousness, what happened to the Republicans being the party of state's rights?

Nova,

Quite simple - for it to happen, 34 States will have to exercise their rights and ratify...

We have to do this, because of something no one expected early on in our Republic - that federal courts would start reading in to the Constitution things which aren't there...we are PREVENTING a judicial usurpation of the right of States to determine what constitutes legal marriage.

Axis,

I think you don't know what tolerance actually is...

Winnow,

I guess you haven't been here long enough...you see, I was in favor of setting up a system of same-sex marriage...what changed my mind was talking to gay marriage advocates and finding out what they are on about...

And what exactly would give you that idea mark? Because I am for leaving the constitution the way it is and leaving the door open for personal choice instead of forcibly banning it?

Thats what tolerance is all about. Recognizing that not everyone shares your views and people are different, personally, religiously and ethnically and leaving the door open for people to express themselves and enjoy personal freedoms without curtailing those freedoms of others.

If Joe and John want to get married or have a civil union, who are you to say that they can't and have a life and how exactly does it threaten your way of life at all? If your Church does agree with marrying gays, then find one that doesn't. Simple as that. Joe and John living down the steet does not in any way affect bill and Sue or Jim and Mary.

Accept people for their differences, tolerate them for their difference and embrace the diversity. you do not need to practice what they do. Thats what makes a multicultural country great mark. How boring would it be in a world where everyone walked, talked and thought the same.

Isolating a segment and penalizing them or oppressing them is regressive and moving in the wrong direction. Soon you will want gay and straight water fountains and the gays will have to sit at the back of the bus. Then there will be segration all over again. Blacks on one side of the streets, whites on another, Hispanicsdown the block and gays can go somewhere else. Have not you learned anything from history at all?

And you say I don't know the meaning of tolerance? I don't think so. But heres the definition so you can understand the real meaning as well.

tol·er·ance Pronunciation Key (tlr-ns)
n.

1. The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others.
2.
1. Leeway for variation from a standard.
2. The permissible deviation from a specified value of a structural dimension, often expressed as a percent.
3. The capacity to endure hardship or pain.
4. Medicine.
1. Physiological resistance to a poison.
2. The capacity to absorb a drug continuously or in large doses without adverse effect; diminution in the response to a drug after prolonged use.
5.
1. Acceptance of a tissue graft or transplant without immunological rejection.
2. Unresponsiveness to an antigen that normally produces an immunological reaction.
6. The ability of an organism to resist or survive infection by a parasitic or pathogenic organism.

That's where you went up onto the rocks my friend. Gay Marriage advocates are radical left wingers that although don't want to force their will on others as radical right wingers do, they want their personal choices literally written into the constitution just as you want it banned in there.

Don't go far right, or far left, stay in the middle where most of america is, (moderate/traditional) who are happy to leave the constitution as it is while simply wanting to have civil unions or gay couples recognized legally so they can enjoy the same quality of life and benefits as everyone else.

Is that so wrong?

Posted by Mark:

"I guess you haven't been here long enough...you see, I was in favor of setting up a system of same-sex marriage...what changed my mind was talking to gay marriage advocates and finding out what they are on about..."

This is just an election year campaign to appeal to the extreme right. It has no chance of passing. Several states have already banned same sex marriage, so why even bother trying to force other states to follow? If states want to ban same sex marriage, then they will do so in the future.

Feingold was correct that such an important issue should be held in open sight of the people they represent. There are many more important issues facing America. Specter is trying to play both sides of the fence saying he was against the ammendment then voting for it.

axis,

I didn't say you couldn't define it, but I did say that I don't think you know what it is...tolerance is tolerance; there's a large difference between tolerance and approval.

I tolerate pornography, you see?

Study after study confirms that most gay people - and especially most gay men - do not want to get married; and even in those that do get married, they still continue to have a large number of sex partners outside of primary relationship.

Study after study, huh? Care to post up a couple? You know, since the "facts" bear you out and all that? Or will you, predictably, bow out while restating your assertion, thinking that saying it again proves it? Probably the latter...you've never been much for actually backing up your position, so why would you start now?

So sad that you're so eager to fight a pointless wedge issue--call it "the suicide of civilization, even." Two guys got married--society is DOOMED! It's funny to read this stuff and remember your claims about how you hat econspiracy theories.

NovaNardis, Axis, SeesThroughIt - why should gay marriage be allowed? Please provide logical reasons for your answers.